Find the Right People

Tyler Leber

I mean, I think a lot of people give great pieces of advice, but the thing that I like to focus on is finding the right people or finding the right co-founder. If you want to, you know, start on your own, like that's totally fine. But if you're, it's kind of like that saying, like, if you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, I can't remember what it was, but go with somebody else, basically.

And so, yeah, I mean, definitely that mindset of, you know, like me and Eric, we complement each other so well. And so there's actually a great book called Rocket Fuel, and it talks about like a visionary and integrator partnership. And that's kind of what we resonate with is, you know, he is the big idea guy. He, you know, he kind of paves the way.

And then I do some of that, but, you know, I am really in charge of executing and making sure things run smoothly and that, you know, the vision doesn't get forgotten and it doesn't, you know, just kind of fade away or fizzle. And just making sure that that is, kept up. So that would be my advice is find somebody that compliments you.

Devin Miller

Hey everyone, this is Devin Miller here with another episode of The Inventive Journey. I'm your host, Devin Miller, the serial entrepreneur that's grown several startups in the seven and eight figure businesses, as well as the founder and CEO of Miller IP Law, where he helps startups and small businesses with their patents and trademarks. If you ever need help with yours, just go to strategymeeting.com, grab some time with us to chat, and we're always here to help.

Now, today we've got another great guest on the podcast, Tyler Leber. And Tyler had a pretty typical experience in high school. Then he went off to, or when he was a junior in college, was trying to figure out what he wanted to do. So it was going the startup route or the conservative, bigger business route.

And so decided to go the startup route. And so started working for a startup. And I think he started as an unpaid internship or intern and moved up all the way up to a co-founder by the end and did that.

Part-time during school and full-time after school. Sold that business, which is called Venture Validator, and then started helping during that time or afterwards, started helping people with finding virtual assistants and started that business on that front and has been doing it ever since. So with that much as an introduction and hopefully mostly accurate, welcome to the podcast, Tyler.

Thanks. Appreciate it. So I just gave a, or condensed a much longer journey into the 32nd, version. So why don't we go ahead and unpack that a bit.

Devin Miller

So tell us how your journey got started with the typical high school experience and then going off to college.

Tyler Leber

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, nothing too much to say about high school. I mean, yeah, really pretty typical. But then I mean, starting in high school, starting pretty early on, I knew I wanted to start my own business, become some kind of entrepreneur.

But I would say starting in high school, I started having some doubts of like, you know, I'm really not as confident. As I think these other entrepreneurs are like, I'm not the big idea guy. Like I don't have a lot of big ideas and like it comes more naturally to other people.

And so that's really like the big development that happened during high school. And so the turning point was in college was when I was looking at, you know, bigger jobs, like, okay, maybe entrepreneurship isn't for me. But then I saw this job posting for director of operations as an unpaid intern at this startup company, Venture Validator. And that's where I met Eric.

Who's now my, who's became co-founder or I became co-founder with him and Venture Validator and now Coconut VA

Devin Miller

Before we get too far into the end of your, or to the present day of your journey. So let's rewind just a little bit. So you're in college and just for the audience, what were you studying at the time?

Tyler Leber

I was studying economics.

Devin Miller

All right. So studying economics and, you know, and as you said, it sounded like you're kind of deciding which route or path to take. Now, when you came across Venture Validator, you were like, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. And then you came across the unpaid internship.

Now, generally you're saying, I'd much rather be paid or make money. And there is a, certainly an aspect or an element of, Hey, I'd like to get experience and get in that direction, get my foot in the door. But you know, how did you, what, what was it that sparked your interest or what made you decide, Hey, I'll go work for somebody for free because I'd rather get experience and going working for bigger companies that will probably pay me.

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So it was pretty easy decision for me actually at the time. We, at the, at the time we didn't have any, we didn't have any, we didn't have any, we didn't have any, we didn't have any debt, my wife and I, uh, and we weren't necessarily, you know, struggling.

I had, uh, I'd been working, you know, part-time job throughout college. And so we had, you know, a little bit of savings. And then I really just was super motivated to, to try it out. Like, you know, I decided like, Hey, I'm in college, like might as well take a risk.

Like, you know, in the future, we'll have kids, we'll have more risk involved in our life. Like, let's just take a little bit of risk right now. Uh, and I, I, my plan was only to do a Venture Validator for a semester, you know, just as an internship.

Uh, and then after that, move on to a different company or, you know, then get some kind of paid job. Uh, but at the end of that internship, uh, it ended up becoming paid. And then I was just, you know, I was kind of smitten with the company and wanted to continue with that.

Devin Miller

No, it makes, uh, makes perfect sense. Now one, maybe one question to follow up, which is, so you did an unpaid internship, which I, I, I get, I, you know, I'd still rather get paid, but if I was saying, Hey, between doing what I, what I am excited about and what I'm going to, or my, or potentially want to do for a career versus going and getting paid, if I only, you know, if those are the two options, I'd rather go get the experience.

So I did that now. How, or you were a junior at the time. So you did, how long did you do the unpaid internship for?

Tyler Leber

Yeah, it was just, I don't know, probably three or four months of yeah.

Devin Miller

Unpaid. Yeah. So then you, and you, you were junior at the time. So does that mean you eventually got started to get paid while you're still at school or did you, or did you graduate after that?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. No, I started to get paid just kind of hourly while I was still in school. And I, I think I did, I think at the time I was still working actually with the air force ROTC on campus at my college. And so, you know, that was a little bit more steady. I knew I was getting some income from there.

And then this one was just the Venture Validator was more hourly, just when I could work and all any time I could put towards it was helpful.

Devin Miller

Makes, makes perfect sense. So now you're, so you're doing the. Venture validator you're moving from unpaid internship to paid internship now. And so you're finishing up the degree, got your degree in economics and sounds like putting words in your mouth, but hopefully not, or accurate words that, you know, you then got an offer to work there full-time.

Is that right?

Tyler Leber

Yeah, correct. So yeah, I was getting wrapping up kind of my college degree and I was definitely still applying to other places and I really wasn't convinced, you know, that entrepreneurship was for me or that venture. Validator was the way to go. And so, yeah, I was definitely putting in applications everywhere.

And I'd heard lots of great things about Vanguard just kind of that financial advisement company and they have a lot of mutual funds. And so I was excited about them. I'd heard a lot of good things. They had awesome benefits, you know, great starting pay.

And so near the end of college, I had kind of two offers in my hand of, you know, Vanguard or Venture Validator. And that was a huge, again, you know, another small turning point of like, okay, which one do I do? You know, full-time, like I'd always been kind of programmed to do more of the conservative route of the, you know, kind of the safe route.

And so like Vanguard seemed like the easy choice or the obvious choice. But then again, you know, I just, I had that desire to, to put a little bit of risk into my life and try it out with Venture Validator.

Devin Miller

So, you know, and I, and I get that on the one hand, you know, it is going to be, it seems like it would be a tough decision. Vanguard's, you know, certainly well-recognized and the big thing, name recognized, good to put on the resume and experience. And yet on the other hand, you're saying, but it may not be, you know, I'm still in you're interested in the ability to pursue startups and small businesses.

And I also get the idea that, Hey, you're doing it with a lower risk. In other words, you're earlier on in your career. If you decide it doesn't work out or it's not what you enjoy or anything of that nature, you still have time to recover versus, you know, if you do it later on in your career, you can still do it, but there are a lot more risks.

So you decide to go work for Venture Validator. And you did that. And so you started full or you did it full-time after graduating. Now, how long, cause eventually you guys sold it off or went in that direction.

But how long did you work there or how long were you a part of the business?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So, and like I said, you know, I started as the unpaid intern and then I just kind of was an employee. And near the end of college is when I first got actually some stock in the company. And so then right after college, I, like you said, you know, I graduated and started working full time. And then it was, let's see, two years working before we were acquired.

And so during those two years, you know, we had several more kind of equity talks and like, Hey, like I'm doing a ton of work. I'm getting this, you know, helping you get off this, get this off the ground. Like, I really think I should get more stock and like, I'm really, you know, invested in this now.

And so eventually, yeah, I became a co-founder in the company. And we, you know, we started to hire other people and it started growing. So yeah, a lot of exciting things. And then, yeah, obviously a lot of mistakes as well that were made.

Devin Miller

So no, and there's always, I think mistakes along the way is, is you're building a company, figuring it out, adjusting the relationship, you know, you come in and then you're saying, Hey, I'm pulling as much or more of the weight and I'm doing a lot or putting in a lot of time and effort. So it makes sense to kind of, you know, adjust the relationship.

Devin Miller

So now as you're doing this for a couple of years and you guys are eventually sold you and you're in under, how did you, you know, did somebody approach you guys? Did you say, and kind of get to the end, you're saying, Hey, we want to do something different or we have a different idea that we want to pursue, or, Hey, we hate each other and we want to part ways or kind of, how did that go that you guys decided to make the transition to selling off the business and going a different direction?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So it was really last year, more than a year ago now, kind of August 2021, we realized that, you know, when we started Venture Validator, we were both kind of, you know, somewhat naive entrepreneurs and like, okay, this is going to be a billion dollar business. Like, you know, all of these grand ambitions for the company and like how much money we were going to be making and all that. Uh, but then we, we really realized that, Hey, this is like a market research firm.

Like really that's all it's going to be. And that's kind of all it ever was. And it really does take some of our personal time. Like we really can't scale it super well.

And just not going to be able to do that, you know, with our startup, with a, with a company. And so, like I said, kind of, uh, August of last year, we realized like, Hey, we might actually be looking for a different company.

Like where would we, where are we going to spend our time after Venture Validator? Uh, and so that kind of started, uh, you know, like kind of a fast track to selling the company, because then we started doing, we used our own systems at Venture Validator of, Hey, what's a, let's validate some other business ideas.

And so one idea that we had was VA staffing and like, what could we bring that's unique to the industry and all that. Uh, and we started scoring really high on our, on these market research, uh, tests and surveys that we did. And so, like I said, you know, starting in August, we got more and more excited about the idea. Uh, and then very soon after that, we, uh, posted the company for sale on micro acquire, um, which yeah, they're fantastic.

They've been awesome. Um, and so just in January of this year, uh, so just, you know, five, six months after we kind of had the idea for Coconut VA, we were able to sell Venture Validator and then me and my co-founder moved, uh, completely over to Coconut VA full-time.

Devin Miller

So now one, and probably gives you an opportunity for a shame of self plug, but I'll ask it anyway, you know, because there are certainly a lot of VA people out there, VA companies out there, you know, for virtual assistants and, for those listeners that may not be quite as familiar, it's usually the people where you're hiring them either virtually can be in the U S a lot of times it's a foreigner offshore.

Um, it usually provides, you know, assistance for getting different tasks done and it's usually less expensive, but you know, I, I would say on a given, I don't know, week or month, I get hit up with multiple people that are, I don't know how good they are, but you know, you get the spam emails or the junk emails are saying, Hey, you need a virtual assistant.

And I've used a few in the past and currently use a couple and they're great and they do a good job. I've also tried them out and some of them are horrible. So kind of what was that? If there's a lot, it seems like there's a decent amount of competition.

What was kind of the, as you guys were using your own Venture Validator system, what were the things that differentiated you guys or you scored highly on?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. And it's, it's really evolved over time. When we first started doing the surveys, uh, we had kind of a different target and target market in mind, you know, with Venture Validator, we were specifically targeting fairly small startups. And so with Coconut VA, that's kind of who we wanted to go after as well.

Um, and so we scored highly with them, uh, because we were taking off a lot of the, uh, kind of the barriers to, to entry for a virtual assistant. So, you know, we were advertising kind of the lowest rate that we could possibly go. So we started out by thinking, okay, $10 an hour.

Like that's what we're really going to push is like, you can find a stellar virtual assistant for $10 an hour. Uh, and then, you know, also a few other things like, uh, you know, no hiring fees or no contracts, you know, kind of like modernizing the industry basically. Uh, you know, that happens in all sorts of different industries, but then also a big thing that we wanted to do is bring like a new, and this is the thing that's kind of stayed with us over time is bringing a new vibe to the industry.

And so, you know, when you get those ads, when you get those emails, when you look at any of their websites, they're all pretty stuffy. And like, you can tell that they're, I don't know, early 2000 era, or, you know, just not super updated, not super modern.

Uh, and so we wanted to go with more of the kind of fun and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, you know, tech website feel, but also bringing in kind of the, uh, like a, more of a tropical vibe, not in like the dorky, like Hawaiian grass skirt kind of way, but, you know, really encouraging founders to, uh, vacation laptopless.

That's kind of one of our slogans that my co-founder came up with is being able to get out of the day-to -day grind. Um, and so that really resonated with, uh, people and that's, what's really fueled our growth is, uh, you know, our connection and our understanding of other founders and what they appreciate, uh, and letting them, you know, achieve their goals through this, through hiring and delegating to virtual assistants.

Devin Miller

Makes perfect sense. So now one question that kind of comes up because, you know, when you I'll, I'll give it to you, co-founding, you know, the previous business, but that one was already up and going early, the concept and some of the idea as you came on board, granted, you get a lot to build it and a lot to grow ed, but now you're moving your transition to, um, you know, the new company, which is not in place when you get started, you may have had, you know, experience with doing it with the other business, but now you're having to start at that one more from the ground up.

Was it, how was that experience? Did it go well? And I guess before all that, did you do it with the same, uh, co-founder you did the other business or did you start this one on your own and how did it go?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So, yep, it was the same co-founder. So Eric Espinosa, he, he was the one that had the idea for Venture Validator. Uh, and then we both wanted, we had both kind of, you know, gotten such a good relationship through Venture Validator. We really enjoyed working with each other and we knew we wanted to start the next business together.

And so, yeah, it was kind of just seamless that we decided, yeah, let's, you know, go in kind of as equals on this next business. Like why not? We've both grown so much.

We both feel like we compliment each other really well, you know, strengths and weaknesses and all of that. Uh, and so, yeah, it was kind of an easy decision to say, yeah, let's just start this next thing together. Um, and then as far as your other question, yeah, it was actually a question. Yeah. I mean, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was quite a bit easier the second time around.

It's like anything, just getting practice for us. We always talk about how Venture Validator was almost an extension of college for us, uh, because we were really just trying our hand at entrepreneurship. We built a successful company and like, we were able to get it sold, which is, you know, amazing.

Like we're amazed that we were able to do that because we made so many mistakes along the way. And at times we moved too slow or we focused on the wrong things. Um, and so those mistakes that we made actually made it a lot easier for us to start Coconut VA Obviously we're not perfect and we're still making mistakes.

Um, but just those basics, those basics to get us off the ground, um, really helped us a ton. And soon we were making more money in Coconut VA, uh, than we did at the height of Venture Validator.

Devin Miller

Well, it's always a good place to be and sounds like, you know, it is interesting, I'd say on some aspect it gets easier. On other aspects, it probably gets harder because you're used to, on some business, it gets easier. But you're able to get things done.

You're able businesses, once you've got it up going, making money and having a degree of success to start the business over with, with, Hey, we don't have a lot of clients. We don't have a lot of revenue. And you're sometimes you almost tend to forget that a bit.

And so it is one where you get easier, you figure out how to do things, but I think it is kind of a, sometimes a shock to the system again of, Oh yeah, I did have to do all this when I started up the business originally. So it's fun to hear that.

So, yeah. So now kind of catch us up. Where's it at today and kind of where are you guys headed?

Tyler Leber

Yeah, definitely. So obviously we started out with just, you know, our internal team. So Eric and I as co-founders, and then we brought over one or two of our VAs from Venture Validator. And so we kind of, that's where we started. And then we got our first client, I think that month actually in August.

So then our first kind of outside VA and from now until then, now we have 50, almost 60 VAs. And then, we're hoping to get to a hundred VAs pretty quickly within the next few months. And so, yeah, so really what we've grown is within a year, we grew to about $750,000 of ARR, so annual recurring revenue.

And so, yeah, like you say, you know, at the beginning it was tough cause we were making nothing and, you know, obviously we didn't pay ourselves for quite a while and we still, you know, it's even after that, it was not getting paid very much. And so, like, yes, there's definitely still risk no matter what in opening any kind of business.

But yeah, that's kind of where we're at. And then we're, yeah, like I said, we're hoping to grow to a hundred VAs pretty quickly within the next few months. And then after that, our goal is 500 VAs.

Devin Miller

Cool. Well, sounds like some great goals and hopefully you're able to hit them or even exceed them and it goes well for you. So, well, now as we've kind of caught up to the present day of the journey, it's always a great time to transition to the two questions I always ask towards the end of each episode.

Devin Miller

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the first question I always ask is along your journey, what was the worst business decision you ever made and what'd you learn

Tyler Leber

from it? Yeah. I love that question. So I'd say the worst business decision we made I mean, it was probably like a ton of little small decisions that led to this big decision, but really just building too much in our first business you know, grand total, it was like three years from start to, you know, selling.

And a lot of that time was, was Eric and I putting our heads together and building things and not bringing in customers and like not talking to customers. Uh, and I'd say that was our biggest flaw and our biggest, like what led to a lot of like financial hardships and like all of these other things that led to other stressors in the business, uh, because we, and it's, it's funny because that's what we told other entrepreneurs not to do, like, Hey, you shouldn't spend money on building this.

You should go out and get customers. And we didn't really take our own advice is, is we built so many systems and part of that is really good. Cause that's kind of what allowed us to sell the business and for us to move on, uh, without, you know, having to stick around very long with Venture Validator.

So in some ways it was a blessing, but overall, uh, I think we would have realized, Hey, we don't like this business model and we don't, you know, we want to get to our next business. It would have helped us realize that quicker if we had just worked with customers more, done more customer interviews and just kind of.

Yeah. Just finding that perfect balance of not, not overbuilding, but not under building.

Devin Miller

No. And it is a balance because we use a ton of systems in our, in, in the law firm as well. Yeah. Um, and it's certainly helpful. You can justify it with one.

It's kind of fun to build if you're on the more nerdy side, which I am. Um, but two it's also, you know, it makes it more efficient, reduces costs, you know, gives you better product offerings and that. And so there is always that tendency to want to build a lot of fun systems because it is kind of fun.

Yeah. And yet it is always that balance of all you're doing is building systems, but you never have any customers to utilize those systems. And it really doesn't help that you're saving money because you're not making money in the first place. So I definitely get as that balance. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs tend to stray, stray on the side of overbuilding things or building too many features and not focusing on the business itself.

So it is a balance. So I, I definitely get that, how to make that mistake, but also a great one to learn from.

Devin Miller

Yeah. Second question now is if you're talking to someone who's just getting into a startup or a small business, what'd be the one piece of advice you'd give them?

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So, I mean, I think a lot of people give great pieces of advice, but the thing that I like to focus on is finding the right people or finding the right co-founder. Uh, if you want to, you know, start on your own, like that's totally fine. But if you're, it's kind of like that, that saying, like, if you want to go fast, go alone, if you want to go far, uh, I can't remember what it was, but go with somebody else basically.

Um, and, uh, so yeah, I mean, definitely that mindset of, you know, like me and Eric, you know, we compliment each other so well. And so there's actually a great book called rocket fuel. Uh, and it talks about like a visionary and an integrator partnership.

Uh, and that's kind of what we resonate with is, you know, he is the big idea guy. He, you know, he kind of paves the way. And then I, I do some of that, but, you know, I am really in charge of executing and, uh, making sure things run smoothly and that, you know, the vision doesn't get forgotten and it doesn't, you know, just kind of fade away or fizzle, uh, and just making sure that, that is kept up.

So that would be my advice is find somebody that compliments you, uh, you, you know, and just, I guess, first find out who you are, you know, are you a visionary? Are you an integrator? Are you neither of them?

You know, what are you? And then find somebody that is almost the opposite of you, but you know, that you still get along with hopefully.

Devin Miller

No, I think that's a definitely, uh, makes perfect sense. So awesome. Well, now as we, uh, do wrap towards the end of the episode, um, if people want to reach out to you, they wouldn't. They're looking for a VA.

So they want to be a customer. They want to be a client. They want to be a B VA or an employee of the business. They want to be an investor or they just want to be your next best friend, any or all of the above.

What's the best way to reach out to you, contact you, find out more.

Tyler Leber

Yeah. So coconutva.com is great, but if you want to reach me, then Tyler at coconutva.com.

Devin Miller

All right. We'll definitely encourage people to reach out. And if they're looking for a new VA, it's a great, uh, great opportunity to get one on board. So with that, thank you again, Tyler, for coming on the podcast. It's been a fun, it's been a pleasure.

Now for all of you that are listeners that are out there, if you have your own journey to tell me you'd like to be a guest on the podcast, we'd love to have you. So just go to inventiveguest.com apply to be on the show. A couple more things as listeners, make sure to click share, subscribe, and leave us a review.

So we want to make sure that we, or, or that we share all these awesome journeys with as many startups and small businesses as we can to help them along their way. And if you ever need help along your way, um, with any patents, trademarks, or copyrights, just go to strategymeeting.com, grab some time with us to chat.

And we're always here to help. Well, thank you again, Tyler, and wish the next. Leg of your journey even better than the last.